um, his excellency can't come to the phone right now ...

By Diogenes (articles ) | Jun 12, 2004

From John Allen's Word from Rome:

During his June 4 visit, Bush asked the Vatican to push the American Catholic bishops to be more aggressive politically on family and life issues, especially a constitutional amendment that would define marriage as a union between a man and a woman.

What's wrong with this picture?

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  • Posted by: - Jun. 14, 2004 7:23 PM ET USA

    I though it was kind of interesting. The Pope lecturing the President of a secular state on how to conduct affairs of state and foreign policy and the President of a secular state (subtly?) advising the Vatican on how to run the church in that secular state. Tit for tat?

  • Posted by: - Jun. 13, 2004 12:13 PM ET USA

    It is more constructive to focus on what is right with the picture:thirty years after Kennedy's pragmatic (a la Sanhedrin) apology to the Baptist Convention, a Protestant U.S. President is seeking the public support of the Holy Father in advancing the cause of Christian ethics in government. The Pope walks a fine line balancing hierarchical control of his bishops while allowing sufficient autonomy. D, you are cynical to the extreme...

  • Posted by: - Jun. 13, 2004 11:30 AM ET USA

    What is wrong with this picture is that Bush used the active verb "push" which goes against the Charism of Unity that our ecclesial spokesman make so much of. This shows that Bush is politically naive, divisive, a luddite and, likely, a bible thumping creation scientist. Those in the know would have instructed the Pope to deliver another warm, platitudinous ode to self esteem and collegiality in order to nudge the majority of Bishops to new levels of mediocrity.

  • Posted by: - Jun. 13, 2004 7:54 AM ET USA

    Is it the Catholic Bishops or the Catholic laity who merit much of the criticism for the inactivity of the Catholic Church and her powerlessness to change society? Are Presbyterian and Baptist laity more responsive to the teachings of the Catholic Church than are the Catholic laity? Pat

  • Posted by: Sterling - Jun. 13, 2004 7:27 AM ET USA

    Here's one thing that's wrong: it's pretty funny coming from Bush, since he's been far from a lion-heart on the marriage amendment. While the majority of Americans long for Bush's vigorous and forthright support, he comes to this issue with the enthusiasm of a reluctant groom dragged to the altar. Maybe Bush feels he could have a little more courage if he could push for this amendment from behind the Holy Father's skirt.

  • Posted by: - Jun. 12, 2004 7:43 PM ET USA

    It's an international rendition of what plays out here in the Bible belt: Protestants having to lecture us on morality due to our priests lacking any. So much for gaining converts. Bush should go where the power in the Church resides...I wonder if Pope Mahony would give him an audience?

  • Posted by: John J Plick - Jun. 12, 2004 7:07 PM ET USA

    "Without putting it in quite these terms, what this Vatican diplomat made crystal clear is that the Holy See does not want to be the ecclesiastical equivalent of France. That is, it does not want a reputation for knee-jerk anti-American sentiment, because if Vatican diplomacy is anything, it’s realistic. Realism in the present world situation means you either work with the Americans, or you sit on the sidelines." Realistic...! Sure! Not for the sake God or truth! Pragmatic, like the Sanhedrin

  • Posted by: John J Plick - Jun. 12, 2004 6:54 PM ET USA

    Diogenes; It's not "What's wrong with this picture?" It's just "Wrong..."

  • Posted by: - Jun. 12, 2004 3:30 PM ET USA

    It's very sad that a Protestant American President has to ask the Pope to get the so-called Catholic bishops in America to effectively support unambiguous teachings and policies of the Catholic Church. Call this spade what it is ... there are good bishops in America - but also many whom St. Pius X would depose as heretics or purveyors of errors contrary to the sensus Catholicus. Shine a light on them, expose them and their errors, once and for all.