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Backbone and biceps

By Diogenes (articles ) | Mar 10, 2005

"We have thrown a lot at our people these past few years, and they need a rest."

That's an American bishop, arguing against changes in the liturgy. But before you get excited, understand this: When he argues against change, what Bishop Lynch means is that the abuses that have become commonplace over the years should not be corrected.

Well, at least not abruptly. The Vatican's orders on liturgical abuse represent "backward movement" and "personal legislation" which no one understands. This contrasts sharply with the "courage and resolve" and the "backbone and [that word again] resolve" demonstrated through liturgical experimentation.

To simplify just a bit-- a very little bit-- Bishop Lynch thinks the orders from Rome are misguided and incomprehensible.

Mind you, he's a good soldier. He wouldn't think of resisting Vatican directives. Oh, no. He's going to carry out orders. Not right away, maybe:

But whatever it is, we must implement the change, and I am certain we will. It may take some time....

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Show 27 Comments? (Hidden)Hide Comments
  • Posted by: - Mar. 15, 2005 10:15 PM ET USA

    Tridentine Mass isn't an idol. I accept Nuove Ordo Mass. Where is one ? Our 5 parishes, 5 different Masses. I know Who is the Eucharist, was one of three who kneel on the floor. Traveling Belgium, was the only one who knelt on the floor. Over age 84 have to give up now. Asked our bishop for altar-rails. Know 2 parishes where priests gives kneeler for who wants to kneel. Just got weekly Trid.Mass 20 km from here. People connect with God, no entertainment. Only priest, altar-boys in sanctuary

  • Posted by: - Mar. 14, 2005 6:40 PM ET USA

    ProGod writes: I can. It's actually quite easy if you've already allowed Mass to become part of yourself, then you just need to pay close attention to what's going on and it'll flow on its own. It's possible to turn anything into an idol; there's been enough comments here the past few months to indicate some people have done just that with the T. Mass. In their eagerness to kill the vernacular, they've lost sight of the Real Presence in both.

  • Posted by: - Mar. 12, 2005 10:10 PM ET USA

    BostonBlackey feels lucky with regular (forbidden) extraordinary ministers, not using Latin prayers the Pope asks us to use. Why complain about pita bread, liturgical dances if your Liturgy is so good !? Only ordained do the Mass, not us. It doesn't matter to us what language he uses. By using Latin, all ordained pray the same. We can pray along in english in a proper missal. Born 1920, never had trouble with Latin. Traveling, had Mass in 5 languages ! Who can pray along in many languages ?

  • Posted by: fisherman129 - Mar. 12, 2005 10:54 AM ET USA

    I've had the same experience many times - a la Boston Blackey.... I agree.

  • Posted by: Novus744 - Mar. 11, 2005 11:42 PM ET USA

    Coming from a schismatic "parish," I do not understand Boston Blackey's comment. I was very young when introduced to the Latin Mass (6 years old), but by the time I was 9 or 10 I remember understanding what most of the words meant, and those that I didn't I learned in Catechism. Even by that time, it seems, I knew more about the Catholic Faith than most modern Catholics do now. Let's bring back Traditional Catholic Education!...but fully in accordance with the authority of Rome.

  • Posted by: AveMaria580 - Mar. 11, 2005 9:22 PM ET USA

    Maybe they have misunderstood Bishop Sheen and thought he said "play at Mass." Lord, deliver us from extra mins, laity swarming in the Sanctuary, junk music and ritualized tupperware parties. Our diocese has started an "Institute for Lay Ecclesial Ministry." You can't get to a priest anymore because of the mob of laity slopping around the Sanctuary and Tabernacle. As a convert, I sometimes think that the greatest fear of Catholics is being different.

  • Posted by: - Mar. 11, 2005 5:02 PM ET USA

    BostonBlackey seems to forget that VCII’s Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy called for the faithful to be able to say certain prayers in Latin. How can one be Catholic and claim not to understand even the basics of the Church’s mother tongue? Some 65 years ago, then-Monsignor Fulton J. Sheen called on all Catholics to “pray the Mass.” Wasn’t that the same participation that the Fathers of VCII later called for, and not the irreverent and sacrilegious prancing and hand waving we have today?

  • Posted by: - Mar. 11, 2005 12:12 PM ET USA

    Obviously BostonBlackey has no experiential knowledge concerning the Tridentine Rite. Latin and English were printed side-by-side in the Missals. If anyone could not understand the Latin, they could not read English either.

  • Posted by: BostonBlackey - Mar. 11, 2005 11:35 AM ET USA

    I must be the luckiest man in America because the three parishes that I attend seasonally (West Roxbury, MA, Marshfield, MA & Palm Bay, FL) have wonderful liturgy, respectful lay ministers and thoughtful, orthodox sermons. Deliver me from all those who would return to the days of the Tridentine Mass with Latin that no one understood. Deliver me as well from the Pita Bread and liturgical dance crowd. Prudence is still the queen of all virtue.

  • Posted by: Abraham Tolemahcs - Mar. 11, 2005 10:59 AM ET USA

    Ditto ProGod! Stop giving the bishops money and send it to a worthwhile Catholic cause that exercises fiduciary/Catholic responsibility. I just sent my bishop another letter in response to the Lenten Appeal which contained a copy of my contributions to the FSSP. No dogma, no dollars. I also asked again for the Indult which he adamantly refuses to allow. The Holy Father asked the Bishops to be "generous" in allowing the Indult & I'm merely returning the bishops generosity.

  • Posted by: - Mar. 11, 2005 10:40 AM ET USA

    Where do they find these screwballs? These guys feel that they are a law unto themselves and that they do not like answering to anyone. Even the Vatican! The time is long overdue when the process of selecting bishops is overhauled. That they themselves have the say in promoting their own kind is a disaster. And once they are in they are there for life. This must be changed. Thinking of themselves as minipopes, the power has gone to their heads. The Vatican needs to use its authority.

  • Posted by: sparch - Mar. 11, 2005 10:16 AM ET USA

    They very idea that one has resolve and backbone based on experimentation is backward. What exactly is to be resoved in experimentation. What courage is there in experimentation of the liturgy. What is being stated is the liturgy as prescribed is wrong and what are we to change, through our resolve , is to worship the way we want. Yet all that can be done is experimentation because we are not sure what we want to do. The experiment has been done, Become Lutheran.

  • Posted by: benedictusoblatus - Mar. 11, 2005 9:55 AM ET USA

    Special thanks to the fathers of the second Vatican Council who imprudently abandoned the Church's perennial precision of thought and decree! They left the Church wide open to attack by the prince of liars and his "progressive" (i.e., Protestant) minions. Confusion and loss of faith, heresy and apostasy, scandal and sadness are the fruit on this sorry tree. It may well take 200 years to pick up the pieces and get the Church back in order. Please God send us saints to begin the true renewal!

  • Posted by: - Mar. 11, 2005 9:11 AM ET USA

    Liturgical chaos has reigned in the wake of the Second Vatican Council. Are we witnessing the wrath of Saints Peter and Paul promised by Pope St. Pius V for changing the Tridentine Rite Mass? Returning the Tridentine Rite to its original lofty spiritual position is the only definitive step in a positive direction. Will I hold my breath? Not a chance. I can imagine how John Milton must have felt when he wrote Paradise Lost.

  • Posted by: - Mar. 10, 2005 10:24 PM ET USA

    It is said that we get the priests and bishops we deserve. Unfortunately,many Catholics in the past took the priests and nuns for granted and did not pray enough (if at all) for them. Thirty years ago how often did one hear someone say (when asked to pray for Father X,) " O, he's holy; let him pray for us." Perhaps we are now reaping what we have failed to sow..."

  • Posted by: Janet Baker - Mar. 10, 2005 10:24 PM ET USA

    He winks at Terri's impending murder and he winks at disobedience to Rome. At least the man is consistent to some degree. Now if he would only relinquish his mitre and crozier ...

  • Posted by: - Mar. 10, 2005 10:15 PM ET USA

    Whenever I read a Catholic complaining about our downfall, I wonder how much he gives for Sunday offering. Save your money in separate account; use it to repair churches, pay devout Catholic clergy. Support Catholic schools that are not bound to a bishop. No money for the Debased Clergy (the DCs; actually Diseased). Also: how pious is he who prays 3 rosaries a day, but has not the least desire to kneel when in front of our Lord, to receive Him ? Demand altar-rails.

  • Posted by: - Mar. 10, 2005 9:57 PM ET USA

    If anyone wants to see what the changes in the liturgy are creating just look at the churches that are built today that are supposed to reflect and enhance the "modern liturgy". The cost of the Los Angeles cathedral didn't bother me it is the incredible ugliness. This abominable monstrosity will never be anything else, despite Cardinal Mahoney's excuses and explanations about the design. I suspect the excuses reflect the same problems with the liturgy. It just doesn't work.

  • Posted by: - Mar. 10, 2005 9:52 PM ET USA

    If the notion of changing back is done all in one piece, then we'll have the same confusion when, in 1963-1966 all the changes were made without proper preparation of the Faithful. I'm for making subtle changes by getting rid of some of the abuses, yes, but no radical changes to something we had before 1963.

  • Posted by: Coco - Mar. 10, 2005 7:10 PM ET USA

    Some of us would be happy with even the smallest liturgical reform--if the lay ministers would not remove the Precious Body of Christ from the tabernacle with all the respect and awe of going to the fridge for a jar of pickles, I would be thrilled!

  • Posted by: - Mar. 10, 2005 5:51 PM ET USA

    Does anyone know whether Bishop Lynch uses pita bread and baskets on the altar, a la the Teflon Cardinal? It would be interesting to know how the litnicks do things in Florida. Perhaps we could have a slide show.

  • Posted by: AveMaria580 - Mar. 10, 2005 5:10 PM ET USA

    One thing that would give people a rest is a reform of the Liturgy. No more cutsy stuff or slovenliness. The slovenliness of the Liturgy is appaling. At least in the parishes I've attended and visited. It is becoming more and more difficult to endure the trite music, excessive use of ex mins who are not trained at all. Fussing around the altar by laity because no took the cup and they have ozs. of consecrated wine left over, Mass is painful. Please give us a rest and reform the Liturgy.

  • Posted by: - Mar. 10, 2005 4:47 PM ET USA

    "The Mass of the Roman Rite, has been reduced on a practical level to a permanent workshop, something done by the people, rather than an action of Christ, an actio Christi. This is a fact accepted by Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, who commented: Today we might ask: Is there a Latin Rite anymore? Certainly there is no awareness of it. To most people the ligturgy appears to be rather something for the individual congregation to arrange." Michael Davies, Liturgical Shipwreck, 1995

  • Posted by: coach1 - Mar. 10, 2005 3:51 PM ET USA

    THIS is the same Bishop Lynch that suggests the Schindlers & Mike Schiavo should have a civilized negotiation about Terri?? Let's sit down and be civilized with a guy bent on murdering his wife. What a disgrace! He doesn't have enough going to be ashamed of himself.. Obey Rome?? Just a mere technicality. Go pay a clerical call on Judge Greer and stand up for Life.

  • Posted by: coach1 - Mar. 10, 2005 3:29 PM ET USA

    I understand that most of the bishops feel that righting the wrongs of decades of abuse might upset the people. Funny nobody seemed to be concerned back in the early sixties when centuries of liturgical norms were trashed over night. The announcement was made at Sunday Mass and implemented the following Sunday. The demolition crews just kept on coming. My current pastor, in his 40's, saw pictures of what our church used to look like before the changes. He was stunned at the beauty.

  • Posted by: - Mar. 10, 2005 3:13 PM ET USA

    "I wonder when and where the current movement backward in liturgy will end and lead?" You kidding, Your Excellency? There is no backward movement, only the inexorable march forward toward liturgical anarchy; something that, judging from your remarks to the FDLC, you will eagerly welcome. "I would understand that it is my duty to find the middle between the law and proper liberation from the law…” Silly me! I thought ALL Catholics were called to obey the law, not to seek release from it.

  • Posted by: - Mar. 10, 2005 2:52 PM ET USA

    How long did it take Mr. oops Bp. Lynch to accept the civil court order regarding Terri Schiavo? I may have been blinking but I missed his short resistance. Mind you, courts according to the original constitution aren't allowed to make laws; but, as with the original constitutions of Vatican II, only the zeitgiest is worth following. Bp. Lynch is salt without savor and a light (dim as dieing embers) under a bushel basket.

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